Re: [TCLCORE] Tcl GSoC 2011 - Ideas anyone ?

In private mail, someone (who can speak up if he wishes) pointed out that all
the other languages used to bind to TK and are moving to something else.

If you think TK is moving just fine, you are both right and completely wrong.
What it has is fine, what has been added is fine, the movement, not so fine.
TK has enough there to be *the* toolkit that everyone wants to use.  For a
long time it was the toolkit.  Now?  Not so much.  It's still better but people
have moved on.  I'd like to bring them back.  I'd like to see 20-something
hackers groovin on TK.  If you look around, we're all old dudes.  My next 
birthday is 50 and I'm young compared to most of the core team and most of
the people doing stuff with tcl/tk.

I challenge you to find a team of 20-somethings that want to use tcl/tk.

My argument is not about stagnation, it is about new developers.  If you
aren't growing you are dieing.  By that metric, tcl is dieing.  TK has
a very good shot at turning that around but not as it stands, the other
toolkits have caught up to what is in the core and that's the benchmark.

All of this is my opinion, I'm happy to be told I'm wrong if that comes
with "here is the data that shows you to be wrong".  Not so much on 
anything else.

--lm

On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 08:52:45PM -0500, Kevin Walzer wrote:
> On 3/10/11 8:35 PM, Robert wrote:> > Also, maybe Tk needs a "core" dev group all by its lonesome if Tk is to> > move forward (whatever forward ends up meaning here). One or two devs> > that are willing to push it along.> >> > I think that Tk is moving along just fine, for the most part, especially > with the new features introduced in 8.5.  It does have core developers > moving it along on various platforms (Jeff Hobbs, Joe English, Daniel > Steffen, Pat Thoyts, Donal Fellows) and a separate group of developers > maintaining important extensions (George Petasis, Tim Baker, Harald > Oehlmann, Csaba Nemethi, myself, and others). What, exactly, is it > missing, except for modern HTML bindings and native printing? > (Admittedly, HTML and native printing are big ones.)> > If you read Larry McVoy's complaints about Tk, you might conclude that > Tk is stagnating, but as I understand it, he has long argued for a > "best-of-breed" Tk distribution that incorporates not only Tk's core but > bits from various extensions, sometimes in lieu of what's included in > the core, so that developers don't have to wade through various Tk > extensions and Tk's core to assemble their own widget toolset.> > I can understand the viewpoint that sees this as a weakness of Tk, but I > don't agree with it. The plethora of Tk extensions is itself a > consequence of Tcl's design--small, compact core that is extremely > extensible. (It's easy to extend, and often needs extending.) There are > widgets in the core and extensions to meet almost every possible need. > That richness is a strength, not a weakness.> > --Kevin> > -- > Kevin Walzer> Code by Kevin> http://www.codebykevin.com> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------> Colocation vs. Managed Hosting> A question and answer guide to determining the best fit> for your organization - today and in the future.> http://p.sf.net/sfu/internap-sfd2d> _______________________________________________> Tcl-Core mailing list> Tcl-...@lists.sourceforge.net> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/tcl-core

-- 
---
Larry McVoy                lm at bitmover.com           http://www.bitkeeper.com

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